Re: [Fis] Re: miscellanea / symmetry

To: <fis@listas.unizar.es>
Subject: Re: [Fis] Re: miscellanea / symmetry
.................................................................
Dear Guy, Loet, Shu=Kun and all Fisers,

I do not see any contradiction between all concepts:

Guy Hoelzer <hoelzer@unr.edu> wrote:
> Loet wrote:
> > For example, if we take a symmetrical distribution of relative
> > frequencies like 3,2,1,1,2,3, the entropy in this distribution would be
> > similar to any other order of it.
>
> I disagree that this is generally true. You seem to be assuming that
> there is no meaning or physical reality (constraint) in the order of
> the sequence.
>
> For example: 1,1,2,2,3,3.
>
> But what if this is not the order in which these values actually appear?

In the example above, Loet and me refer to an ordinary distribution,
for which the time ordering is not considered. For symmetry, space
ordering is considered, not chronological ordering.
If you consider the time here, it is no more a distribution from
a r.v. takimg values in R^d, but it is rather a random process,
for which the theories of symmetry are AFAIK, not yet operating.

Also, the differences between symmetry and entropy in my previous
email was about informational entropy. There is no contradiction
with Shu-Kun theory, which deals with thermodynamical entropy.
For these latter, logical symmetries (degeneracy of states), and
spatial symmetry (chambers) lead to decrease the combinatorial
enumeration of the microstates, and thus there is an effect on
the calculation of thermodynamical entropy (even if an information
theoretical model of entropy is used to modelize the thermodynamical
entropy).

Michel Petitjean Email: petitjean@itodys.jussieu.fr
Editor-in-Chief of Entropy entropy@mdpi.org
ITODYS (CNRS, UMR 7086) ptitjean@ccr.jussieu.fr
1 rue Guy de la Brosse Phone: +33 (0)1 44 27 48 57
75005 Paris, France. FAX : +33 (0)1 44 27 68 14
http://www.mdpi.net http://www.mdpi.org
http://petitjeanmichel.free.fr/itoweb.petitjean.html
http://petitjeanmichel.free.fr/itoweb.petitjean.freeware.html
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Received on Mon Apr 26 12:20:15 2004