Re: [Fis] Re: What is information?

Yes, I agree. Everyone on this list should read van Foerster 1960, whiuch has been republished recently in a colllectionn of his papers callled "Understanding understanding" First paper. Do it!

John

Professor John Collier
Philosophy, University of KwaZulu-Natal
Durban 4041 South Africa
T: +27 (31) 260 3248 / 260 2292
F: +27 (31) 260 3031
email: collierj@ukzn.ac.za
http://ukzn.ac.za/undphil/collier
>>> "Julio Stern" <jmstern@hotmail.com> 10/21/05 7:00 PM >>>

>From: "Koichiro Matsuno" <CXQ02365@nifty.com> Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005
>15:41:04 +0900
>
> Once we accept spatiotemporal homogeneity to start with, the real
>numbers would turn out quite convenient in accessing
>how close or separated once something happens to be located there.
>
> A big problem associated with the real numbers is how one could come up
>with the natural numbers. Emergence of the natural numbers to us is what
>emergence of quanta, the atomic numbers and the like is to nature.
>

I believe this (big!) question has been solved by von Foerster:

``Eigenvalues have been found ontologically to be discrete, stable,
separable and composable, while ontogenetically to arise as equilibria
that determine themselves through circular processes. Ontologically,
Eigenvalues and objects, and likewise, ontogenetically, stable behavior
and the manifestation of a subject's ``grasp'' of an object cannot be
distinguished.''

``There is an additional point I want to make, an important point.
Out of an infinite continuum of possibilities, recursive operations
carve out a precise set of discrete solutions. Eigen-behavior generates
discrete, identifiable entities. Producing discreteness out of infinite
variety has incredibly important consequences. It permits us to begin
naming things. Language is the possibility of carving out of an infinite
number of possible experiences those experiences which allow stable
interactions of your-self with yourself.''

Best, -- Julio Stern (jmstern@hotmail.com)

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Received on Sat Oct 22 17:30:24 2005